Using present tenses while talking about the future

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Biopolitics

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In many languages, verbs in one of the present tenses are used for statements made about the future. For instance, Germans often say Ich komme zu Dir morgen (literally: I come to you tomorrow). Likewise, Russians tend to avoid using any future tenses (my personal observation). Chinese has no future tenses at all (more precisely, they add no special particle to their sentence when talking about the future; however, a special particle is used in reference to the past). Is any similar pattern possible in English? I know that the announcer at an airport may say: The plane leaves in three hours or, when making a date, one may say: I'm collecting you/picking you up tomorrow at the railway station. How often is the future grammatically interpreted as the present?
 
I'm not sure I understand your question clearly. Are you asking whether English has a future tense? No, it doesn't. We use the present tense to talk about the future, along with modals such as 'will' and the semi-modal 'be going to'.
 
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I could say I'm going shopping or that I'm going to Shomars (a local restaurant). There is little or no chance of a misunderstanding.
 
What I mean is whether it's sometimes possible to do without a modal verb when talking about the future. Once again, the example I'm sure about is The plane leaves tomorrow at 6 a.m. and, for the Present Continuous, I'm collecting you at the airport tonight.
 
Like in German.
 
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Except that there are no progressive forms in German.
 
It sounds funny but some unhinged young guys in Germany keep trying to invent progressive tenses by saying something like Ich bin hier sitzend und auf Dich wartend (I'm sitting here and waiting for you). Sure, this sounds more than weird.
 
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It sounds funny but some unhinged young guys in Germany keep trying to invent progressive tenses by saying something like Ich bin hier sitzend und auf Dich wartend (I'm sitting here and waiting for you). Sure, this sounds more than weird.
It might sound weird now but all languages evolve. It's entirely possible that in a couple of decades, that will have become normal usage.
 
@Biopolitics please remember to end your posts with a period/full stop. I have edited all your posts in this thread to provide them.
 
I think this discussion seems to touch on a more general philosophical subject (please forgive my German habit to philosophize whenever possible): the perception of time. Starting from the beginning of the Modern Age (or even earlier), Europeans have been considering time as linear; time has been compared to an arrow flying from the past via the present to the future. This is reflected in all European languages which, accordingly, have three different forms of verbs (tenses). However, some Oriental cultures envisage time as cyclic, and then moving into the future ultimately brings you back to the starting point. For instance, Indians traditionally believed that the whole world was undergoing repetitive cycles known as Brahman's days. This worldview influences Asian languages that may have no future verbal forms. A trend that has relatively recently started to develop in some European languages is based on avoiding future tenses/forms of verbs. This clearly manifests itself in German where the future-indicating auxiliary verb werden (routinely put before an infinitive) is being increasingly omitted by most speakers, especially in an informal setting. That's why I'm curious about a similar trend in present-day English. Is the West becoming increasingly Orientalized? Will it also consider time as cyclic?
 
Where to start with that?!

Starting from the beginning of the Modern Age (or even earlier), Europeans have been considering time as linear; time has been compared to an arrow flying from the past via the present to the future.

This is not really a 'European' thing. The linear conception of time can be very loosely associated with the Abrahamic eschatological idea of a movement towards a future point commonly identified as the 'end of the world'. As such, it's common throughout the Middle East and the Muslim world more widely. Note that this is a mythological conception rather than a linguistic one.

This is reflected in all European languages

Not true by any means.

If you're going to generalise this, I think you can say that (I need to check the evidence) Indo-European cultures have a front-back conception of time, where the future is forward ahead of you and the past is back, behind you. These conceptions are revealed not by the tense/aspect systems of language but rather by the metaphors people live by.

which, accordingly, have three different forms of verbs (tenses).

Well, no. As we've established, neither German nor English has a future tense, for example, both being very closely related linguistically as West Germanic by family. This is a feature of the Germanic family of languages more broadly, as far as I know.

However, some Oriental cultures envisage time as cyclic, and then moving into the future ultimately brings you back to the starting point.

That's correct. Indic cultures too.

This worldview influences Asian languages that may have no future verbal forms.

I think that's probably the case, yes. I do think that language is influenced by worldview, yes, but it's also a little the other way round, like a feedback loop.

A trend that has relatively recently started to develop in some European languages is based on avoiding future tenses/forms of verbs.

Example? Evidence?

This clearly manifests itself in German where the future-indicating auxiliary verb werden (routinely put before an infinitive) is being increasingly omitted by most speakers, especially in an informal setting.

That's interesting. Can you give me an example of this, so I know what you're talking about?

Is the West becoming increasingly Orientalized? Will it also consider time as cyclic?

No. Why would it?

My view, in a nutshell, is that conceptions of time come primarily from the way the human body interacts with its surroundings, and then are modified and reinforced by the stories/myths that we tell ourselves.
 
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Plenty of examples in German. They typically say: Ich fliege morgen nach Berlin (literally: I fly tomorrow to Berlin)
 
That is because German, like English, has no future tense. Neither language has ever had one.
 
Plenty of examples in German. They typically say: Ich fliege morgen nach Berlin (literally: I fly tomorrow to Berlin)

I think you may be confusing tense with meaning. The German sentence above is in the present tense, even though it talks about a future event. There is no future tense in German. The futurity comes from the time phrase 'morgen'.
 
The curious point is that the future-indicating modal verb is often missing even though the speaker is talking about the future.
 
It is not missing. It was never there.
 
The traditional grammar pattern is as follows: Noun/pronoun + a form of the verb werden + Infinitive for Futurum I. For instance: Das Weltall wird sich endlich verringern (The Universe will eventually shrink). However, so many speakers do without this verb
 
It seems to me that our discussion necessitates a precise definition of the term verbal tense. Does the notion of tense always imply some change in the verb involved (like adding an ending)? Defining the notion unambiguously would be of some interest to confused non-native speakers and avoid misunderstandings like calling the German Futurum eins (auxilliary verb werden + infinitive) a future tense. If a change in the verb is mandatory, then, for instance, only Romanic languages do certainly have future tenses. Take French: the verb montrer (to show) produces Je montre (I'm showing) as the present tense and Je montrai (I'll show) as the future tense. Once again, I re-emphasize that different temporal lingiusitic patterns do reflect different worldviews. Are the speakers of Romanic languages more future-oriented (idealistic) and those of Germanic languages more present-focused (down-to-earth)? I certainly hope not to hurt anyones's feelings
 
There is no universally accepted definition of tense. for many grammarians today tense-forms are single-word forms of the base form. Others still allow it to cover forms constructed with auxiliary verbs (such as the English perfect and progressive forms) and certain modals.
Are the speakers of Romanic languages more future-oriented (idealistic) and those of Germanic languages more present-focused (down-to-earth)?
I doubt if any serious linguist would entertain such an idea.
 
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